[Pumptesting] PROBLEM UPDATE - next step Aug 11 2025 - diagnostic test of fire pump tank float switch sensor

Sun Aug 10 20:36:10 EDT 2025

Last time the tank sensor was flaky, Daver and I not replaced the battery and didn't call Encore. That was...I dunno, a month or two ago?

I am not sure if Encore inspects the level sensor at all, tbh, since that's not technically part of the fire pump? OTOH, it is possible it was inspected, and was working on the day they happened to show up.

Adam

On Sunday, August 10th, 2025 at 8:33 PM, Tara Halwes <tarahalwes at gmail.com> wrote:

> Yes and no, please stand by?
>
> What did they do last time the tank sensor wasn't working? Is that when the control panel 12v battery was replaced? Can you forward any service notes or any visit summary from their recent quarterly inspection if you have them? We obviously need to consult with them soon but I want this data point first. I'm wondering why this wasn't noticed at that time, for example, and or if something in their inspection knocked a battery terminal loose.
>
> I'm not looking to place blame but I want to get as clear a picture as we can of the symptoms and timeline so we can get the right thing fixed sooner.
>
> For my birthday I would like:
> Coffee
> Data collection
> And maybe a pastry
>
> Tara
>
> On Sunday, August 10, 2025, Phéna Proxima <adam at phenaproxima.net> wrote:
>
>> Just FYI, this is absolutely something I'm comfortable calling in Encore to deal with to diagnose, if you'd prefer. Please keep me posted. I can certainly call them and ask them to come out.
>>
>> Adam
>> On Sunday, August 10th, 2025 at 8:10 PM, Tara Halwes <tarahalwes at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Don't worry, you can still join the fun too.
>>>
>>> The pump tank sensor or something in the box with the controller for it is messed up, causing it to always signal "refill me! I'm not up to 7 feet yet!" ... Even when it's overfilled and dumping to the swale.
>>>
>>> For now (since the water issue Saturday night) the tank sensor and controller are again disconnected from both wall and battery power, because when we reconnect them all of the fresh water dumps out of the freshwater reservoir in less than half a day and then we have no water on site.
>>>
>>> Except in the swale, that gets quite wet. Not very useful unless you're a frog.
>>>
>>> However we know that the fire pump tank level was maxed out because it overflowed, so it hit just above 8 ft.
>>>
>>> We also know no sprinklers have gone off so there is still plenty of water in there.
>>>
>>> We (or someone so may as well be pump testers plus Daver and Ryan), on behalf of the Sawyer Hill trustees (especially while Adam is in Canada), need to keep an eye on the level while the sensor is not working and the autofill is disabled.
>>>
>>> Next step will be tomorrow around ... I think we said 1:30 p.m.. DaveR and I will disconnect the sensor from the controller so that we can test it independently and see if it's totally blown or what.
>>>
>>> Hopefully it is totally blown.
>>>
>>> No really, that would be great because that would be a single specific thing that we know needs to be replaced and would explain the bad behavior.
>>>
>>> If the sensor seems fine then we have a problem in the Levcon controller or the part of the box that the power comes through from the wall outlet. Ryan tested the voltage at various points though and I don't think that side component is faulty. It's only spitting out 10.2 volts to the control panel but on closer inspection the control panel should be happy with anything above 9 volts up to 24. We don't think it's the battery because that was recently replaced and also was able to successfully take a charge on a trickle charger when removed from the control panel. So most likely the Levcon control panel itself or the float tank sensor.
>>>
>>> The battery was behaving really strangely while connected to the controller, but the leads to the terminals were loose and the connection was bad which might be part of the battery draining. Maybe it also messed up something in the controller that can get unmessed up. I'm not sure exactly, but I don't think the new battery itself is the source of the problem, I think it's just a symptom.
>>>
>>> I'm not actually sure what our next step will be after testing the sensor, but we are in the process of ruling out various possibly failed components while still protecting both the fire suppression and freshwater systems.
>>>
>>> Tara
>>> 508-361-9605
>>>
>>> On Sunday, August 10, 2025, Courtney Lewis <courtney.d.lewis at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> For some reason, all of these emails are just showing up in my email box now?
>>>> Sorry you guys have been dealing with this all week
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my phone with the “help” of my two young ones
>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 10, 2025, at 3:09 PM, Tara Halwes <tarahalwes at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> After 2 days the battery is up from around 6V to around 8.5V. Still not 12V but I guess it's charging now? (And / or I don’t actually know how to use a multimeter)
>>>>>
>>>>> tank level display is still jumping around wildly, but went from a lower jumping range to a higher jumping range after I unplugged and then plug back in the battery charger. Still, the highest number I’ve seen flash on the screen is 6.7 and scrolling through the relay statuses, the auto fill should be going (and still is not). Based on DaveR's Prior troubleshooting guesses, I assume this could still be due to the battery not being sufficiently charged for that relay to successfully signal the solenoid it's supposed to talk to. we had hoped it would have come on by now, but we were also assuming that the battery would be back up to 12 V by now, so I believe the next step is either too immediately replace this battery or two continue letting it charge and check back to see if the tank fill line has been triggered by tomorrow or Sunday.
>>>>>
>>>>> I’m hoping to have provided enough detail here that any regular tester on this list could check on that if you're available this Sunday but if it’s not clear enough what I’m talking about please let me know.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Aug 6, 2025 at 17:18 Tara Halwes <tarahalwes at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The tank level was still reading low, fluctuating rapidly between around 4.7 and 5.1 feet.DaveR came out and did a visual inspection, and we measured it at approximately 6 feet, which means the sensor reading is incorrect, but also the level is still low enough that the auto fill solenoid should have triggered, and it very obviously was not running. So a couple things need to happen in the next day or two.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First is we need to give the battery on on the sensor panel time to recharge. The battery was down to something like 6 V and should be at 12. It’s fairly new. One of the terminal leads was extremely loose so that was tightened and it is possible That will be enough to get it to charge correctly. It is also possible that when it charges correctly, The other issues will resolve, but in case they don’t:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Make sure the battery charged back up to 12 V
>>>>>> - Verify the auto fill triggered and the tank is back up to 8 feet, or at least above 6.9.
>>>>>> - if it sounds like it’s filling, but the panel still reads low, visually inspect the tank level. Also check for running water sounds in the great behind unit number 80 as that would indicate it kept filling past 8 feet which it should not do if the sensor is working correctly.
>>>>>> - Recalibrate the tank level sensor if it’s still reading incorrectly, but the tank has filled back up. This procedure should be covered in the manual above the control panel, but if not, DaveR can help.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Default plan is Tara will do these things, but various medical appointments might necessitate someone else stepping in to check on the battery, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The rest of the test went fine and does not need to be redone until next week. The system will come off of TEST in four minutes at 5:21 PM. I will be unavailable for further troubleshooting this evening, but the battery needs to charge anyway.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tara
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Aug 6, 2025 at 14:51 Mike Gaisford <mgaisford at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I’m not been able to get back there to test. If you’re able to do it that would be great. Otherwise, I will try to do it tonight.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Aug 6, 2025 at 2:43 PM Tara Halwes <tarahalwes at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hey Julius or Mike,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Did you re-test? If you did, let me know soon? Otherwise I’ll attempt it sometime in the next 2 hours and report back.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I’m reachable by phone or SMS text to:
>>>>>>>> 508-361-9605
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cheers!
>>>>>>>> Tara
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 5, 2025 at 12:37 Phéna Proxima <adam at phenaproxima.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Mike asked if we should re-test. Per Daver:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, re-test as normal. If it keeps happening, try only opening the test valve enough to get a consistent drop in pressure.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Any further questions, let me know. I will also document this conversation and its findings in the SH trustee manual.
>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, August 5th, 2025 at 12:20 PM, Mike Gaisford <mgaisford at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So is the direction to retest?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 5, 2025 at 12:12 PM Phéna Proxima <adam at phenaproxima.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Update from Daver on the sensor issue:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> No need for Encore. What happened is that the waterflow sensor for the building's own sprinkler system tripped. The waterflow sensor is near the test valve. If there's a lot of turbulence in the pipes, that can fool the sensor into thinking there's water flowing. Opening the test valve wide open can make this more likely.
>>>>>>>>>>>> It doesn't mean there's anything wrong. Just keep lowering the pressure until it gets to 80 PSI and the main pump turns on.
>>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>
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